Question Crashing version 21 build 208

Hi Derek

I posted on Magic my recent scan taken with MediaInfo after a crash about 30 minutes ago. I also added another post mentioning that the file in question worked without any glitches with version 20.

I'm copying an answer received after my post (MediaInfo) from RogerS. I must tell you that the verry technical vocabulary used in his response does not help me at all. If you can decrypt??? 

RogerS wrote on 4/28/2024, 10:55 AM
This is interlaced media. Try making sure the project is progressive (project properties has settings for deinterlacing methods). Interlaced projects don't work with GPU renders and might cause issue with some Fx.Otherwise in 20 if it doesn't work well with the so4compound decoder you can check "enable legacy AVC" to use an even older one (compoundplug) that was around when media like this was common. Still make sure the project is progressive. These are my best guesses- it really should work!

Again thanks for that Derek

Michel

 

Hi Derek,

Of course you don't have to decrypt the text sent to me by RogerS. Frustration got me there. 

This is the Text I sent to someone on Magix site that provided an answer that did not help. He was telling me to go in the i/o tab and apply a check on an item there.
The following is a copy of the text I just sent him...  To Magix contributors to my never ending story,I did apply the proposed correction without ''unchecking'' any other items on that tab. It did work for the clip in question, the one for which I sent a MediaInfo text file. I continued working on my timeline trying to replace clips in the order I wanted, had to go back to the beginning of that Timeline 2 minutes before, the screen suddenly became black, pressed Escape and the attached file shows the error message accompanying that frozen screen.My frustration level has reached a pinnacle. I just invested, 100$ US a little bit more than a week ago to purchase that app. I was using Version 20 with the nasty sound at the end of clips on the Timeline, hopping that a patch would be provided, seems like it wont happen so I bought Version 21.If I want to advance with this project I must restart for the fifth time and I will use version 20 and deal with the nasty sound hopping that eventually a patch for either build 300 or 208 for Version 21 is provided to correct the problem I'm dealing with for the last week and a half.Voilà...thanks for the helpMichelNot  expecting feedback Derek. Just wrote you that message because you did implicate yourself on the Magix site for the use of my CPU.

Hi Michel,

I don't have much time at the moment, but I am making time to reply to you.
I can't say anything quickly, because it's all complicated stuff.

I am saying this completely neutral in tone, OK.
You appear to be the unluckiest person I have ever known to use a computer.
I don't know why only yourself experiences these problems?
I suspect you probably have multiple small problems on your computer, which is causing a combined effect in VEGAS Pro 21, in combination with the type of video your are editing with.
These problems will most likely be Windows and Driver related.
I will supply you with more information on the official VEGAS Pro forum soon, about how to update your computer's BIOS and AMD CPU drivers.
A bad Windows update combined with a potential Motherboard/CPU driver problem, could very well be the cause of all your constant problems, that no one else seems to be experiencing.
When I first started using the AMD 5800X CPU, I was experiencing constant problems - all these problems ended when I updated the BIOS and installed the new Chipset Drivers.
Because your problem is so complex, you will have to be patient until all parts are looked at and updated - I do realize how frustrating this must feel.

Some background information:
The VEGAS Pro program is being completely re-written at the moment.
MAGIX made an announcement last year, stating that they were making significant investments in VEGAS Pro.
The amount of software engineers has increased a lot.
They are currently re-writing the base code for the program and replacing it with the most up-to-date software code used in modern video editing programs.
The first BIG update of re-written code, appeared in Build version 300.
All older versions of VEGAS Pro, like version 20, 19, etc... are using very old software code.
They are basically re-building the entire engine from scratch and it is being extensively tested by a large BETA testing team, before each release.

Windows error code 0xc000012d
Luckily, the low resolution screen shot you uploaded, revealed some important information, that may be at the Heart of your problem.
I had to download that screen shot you uploaded and then zoomed in 500% to read it.
Windows, not VEGAS Pro, is reporting error code 0xc000012d
Error code 0xc000012d is a generalized Windows error, that can be caused by many different things.
The first thing I read online, is a potential low memory problem.

Re-boot computer before editing
Re-boot your computer before editing with VEGAS Pro.
Don't use other programs while editing.

Make sure VEGAS Pro 21 does NOT open last project when booting up!
This setting should always be turned OFF !
Go to Options / Preferences / General
Turn OFF Automatically open last project on startup

Windows Updates
Check all your Windows Updates are installed.
I recently posted detailed instructions for how to check for ALL updates in Windows 11.
Please read the instruction here and make sure you have Advanced Options turned on and checking for updates.
If it was turned OFF, turn it ON, then run Windows update.
Then go back into Advanced options - Optional Updates and install anything that appears.
If you see updates for anything related to Microsoft .NET, that is extremely important, because VEGAS Pro uses .NET to perform critical functions.
www.moviestudiozen.com/forum/vegas-pro/3441-rendering-progress-dialog-in-vegas-pro18#16704

While I am writing this message for you, something wonderful happened !!
The very thing I am telling you to look out for, has appeared on my own computer.
An optional update for .NET Framework has appeared. This is the exact program VEGAS Pro uses, to function properly, therefore keeping this up-to-date is VERY IMPORTANT !

 

RogerS replies
Open VEGAS Pro
Hold the Shift key down - keep pressing it
Select Options
At the bottom you now see a new option that says Internal
This is a special internal menu for nerds and software engineers.
Select Internal, then let go of Shift key
Type "legacy" in search box
Set Enable Legacy (Mainconcept AVC/AAC) = TRUE (type TRUE)
This switches back on the old video decoder
It can sometimes help when working with older Interlaced video.



I am now taking a break for dinner and will continue with reply for AMD CPU info on the official VEGAS forums.
Give me some time.
I thought I could do all this in one go, but 2 hours has just passed.

 

Hi Derek and RogerS,

Thank you for the time you are taking to help me with this nasty and frustrating problem Derek and Roger. The only thing I can mention at this point, is that I have a Project that I had to finish on May 1st...tomorrow, two weeks ago. I'll have to work double time with Version 20. I've advanced a lot yesterday on that Project with Version 20. No crashes, no frozen screens, no glitches except the nasty sound at the end of a video clip. Why is 21 so complicated to work with if 20 is a breeze. Just don't get it.

I will use and apply any and all corrections you propose that will improve my all around system. I will apply corrections for 21 right now but if I notice anything that can impeach the adequate working of that app. I will immediatly go back to 20. I will inform you on evolution on that matter

Thanks again guys, really appreciate it...have a great one.

Michel. 

Hi again Michel

When you have finished your project, rested yourself and have time to reflect, could you do something for me.
I would like to know is causing your problem.
I think it is important to find out why your project works in VEGAS Pro 20, but does not in VEGAS Pro 21.
My guess is that it could be as simple as the type of Video you are using in your project.
There maybe something simple that needs to be adjusted in the code for VEGAS Pro 21, to get everything working without crashing.

I looked at the MediaInfo report you uploaded on the official VEGAS Pro forums.
www.vegascreativesoftware.info/us/forum/crashing-all-the-time--145448/?page=1#ca912690

Your video is Interlaced, which is an older video format that I would not recommend using, if it is possible to change the recording settings on your Sony camera.
Progressive style video is better and what more than 95% of people record and edit with. 
Your video also uses 5.1 Dolby Digital Surround Audio.
I would guess that 99% of people only use Stereo Audio in their VEGAS Pro projects.
My guess is that the combination of Interlaced video and Multi-track 5.1 Surround audio, may be the cause of the problem - probably a Video Decoder bug/problem inside of the updated VEGAS Pro 21 code.

Do you know what the exact model of your camera is ?

Did your project contain 100% video recorded with your Sony camera?
OR
Did you also add video recorded with a Mobile Phone in the project?

If your project contains video from a Mobile Phone, that would be the more likely cause of crashed, in my experience.

When you have time, could you please send me a copy of your Your-Project.veg file that was created and saved with VEGAS Pro 21.
This is a small file and contains no video or audio, but will show me all your settings and a ghost image of your timeline and where your media is located.

The other thing that is important for diagnosing this problem, is any error reports.
If VEGAS Pro 21 showed the Error Report window when VEGAS crashed, that contains important information about what caused the crash.
When that Error Report window opens, there are check boxes near the bottom, that need to be turned on.
This will normally populate the window with a report. Copy that data and upload as a reply in the forum here.

I would love to be able to make this crash happen on my own computer in VP21, so that I can understand what is going on.
It seems like it should be something easy to fix.

Hi Derek, You’re imposing yourself a big order. Relly tanks you for that.The scanned file with the MediaInfo app. was in fact a product of my Sony Handy cam (HDR-XR500) which I bought usedm, 12 years ago and never thought of improving because of a certain stability. It was set for HD at 1920x1080. If I make a search (F3) in the camera Guide I can see no articles or titles pertaining to Interlace or Progressive. That camera has been on the market for 15 years.I always liked the feeling and versatility of a camera I’ve been using  Probably am I at a junction were I’ll have to decide in using a phone, mine (Galaxy S-20 FE) is decent but there are better ones, but I still prefer a camera. If you are telling me Derek that Vegas is working on a more modern version of 21; should I stick with 20 until I decide to upgrade my camera, that might be a short term possibility? Can you tell me what camera you are using and for how long?The Project I’m working on is my annual family video that ends with the birthday of my grand-son who celebrated 17 years son April 18. I already started working on the project around that date, but this years everything got screwed with 21.  Of course no one in my family will give me hell if I don’t publish today, I, myself have imposed that delay.My project included a mixture of video recorded by my Camera and with both different phones from my two daughters in law. One has a recent I phone.I would say that my videos represent about 60% of the whole project with very few pictures.The .veg file I’m sending you, contains all clips and media saved while I was able. It was very tedious for me to get to that point and decided to stop and restart with version 20.To be sure I understand, on the subject of the Error Report, are you asking me to try and create an error report or is there some place at the bottom of the screen where I could find an error Report Window. If it is the case, I can’t see any thing. I went on Youtube yesterday. I know that for many years you preferred not touching the RAM, mine is at a minimum of 200 and my GPU acceleration is Off. Also noticed that many people go in the Internal and apply corrections like legacy, compound and opencl/.  Good idea?What I’ll do Derek, is take VP 21 and simply shoot media on the timeline and see what happens. WOW, I created video and sound timelines and simply copied a minimum of 150 video clips made with my camera  and two IPhones 12. While I was copying those huge bundles of media I was sure to hit a major crash or freeze…NADA. I was able to copy all that stuff within 5 minutes (2 weeks of vacation)  without a glitch…I just don’t get it…another mystery? Before you decide to try and replicate my problem I’m having on my end with VP21, I suggest that I create the vacation Project with the RAM based at a minimum and NO GOU Acceleration.I’m sending you as asked the “VEG file on my Family Project (Simon - 17 ans.veg) and the Vacation (Rep. Dominic.).veg file I just created.Besides what is working and not with VP21, I realize that it is about time I make changes with my camera. I’ll be waiting for the info on yours and at the same time, check what the market has to offer.Thanks a lot for your input Derek, I really appreciate your time and knowledge in resolving my issue.

Hi Michel
I am extremely busy at the moment, working on new tutorials for the first time, in a long time.
I only have so much energy for problem solving, so I gave myself a new rule of only doing a little bit each day (especially on the forum).

Your Sony HDR-XR500 is an older style video camera that only records as Interlaced Video.
I had a quick read of the online manual here:
www.sony.com/electronics/support/res/manuals/4131/41314741M.pdf

There is one setting on your camera that you may want to consider changing ?
Your Sony HD video camera is unique in that it can record 5.1 Surround Sound Audio, but it can also record in regular two channel Stereo.
If you never render and/or watch/listen to your videos using 5.1 Surround Sound Audio, I would recommend setting the camera to record in Stereo mode only.
Stereo audio in VEGAS Pro, will make things simpler.

I talk to many different VEGAS Pro users, who experience all sorts of problems.
I have noticed that some content creators who work with video that contains 5.1 Surround Sound Audio, recorded with older style cameras, seem to always end up experiencing more problems than other people.

Should I stick with 20 until I decide to upgrade my camera, that might be a short term possibility?

If I was experiencing problems like yourself, I would definitely use the program that causes the least amount of pain.
However, whenever I have experienced problems with Video that cause strange problems in VEGAS Pro, my number solution is normally to convert any troublesome videos with Handbrake.
I'm sure I have said this to you before. If you're using videos recorded with a Mobile Phone, I would 100% convert them from Variable Frame Rate into a stable Constant Frame Rate.
I also would make sure that every single video in the project is using the exact same Frame Rate.
That also means making sure your Project Properties = Source Video Properties = Render Setting Properties.

When you mention that you are using many different videos from different Phone Cameras, that is a BIG RED FLAG for me.
There is nothing wrong with using video from cameras, however, when it is from different cameras that possibly used different settings, that is going to be the most likely cause of VEGAS Pro crashing all the time. That is why you should convert every single video from all phone cameras, with Handbrake !!

On the subject of the Error Report, are you asking me to try and create an error report or is there some place at the bottom of the screen where I could find an error Report Window.

The Error Report window is an automatic function, that normally pops up when VEGAS Pro crashes.
The Extra Information that window provides in the check boxes near the bottom, is some of the most important information for discovering the exact cause of the problem.
You will have to try and make VP21 crash to get this window to appear - but it must be for problem project.

I know that for many years you preferred not touching the RAM, mine is at a minimum of 200 and my GPU acceleration is Off. Also noticed that many people go in the Internal and apply corrections like legacy, compound and opencl/.  Good idea?

Yes, never change the Dynamic RAM setting - most people on YouTube don't understand what this setting does - it has nothing to do with timeline editing!
You are on a modern computer, so there should be no reason at all to change any of these internal settings.
Once again, this is why I recommend converting phone videos with Handbrake !!!!!!! Then you will have normal video that decodes/encodes with zero problems.

Converting Phone Video with Handbrake
I can upload my recommended Handbrake Setting for you, if you like.
But before I do that, I need to get a MediaInfo report for every different type of video that went into your project !!
If you were using videos that came from 3 different phones (even if they are the same phone type), I would need a MediaInfo report for each video type.
I will then discover what Frame Rate, Frame Size and Video Codec, each different source is using.
Example:
1. Sony HD Video Camera video sample
2. iPhone camera #1, from owner #1.
3. iPhone camera #2, from owner #2.
4. Samsung Galaxy phone video, from owner #3
 

Hi,

I will forward answers to your questions on the May 6th. post Derek as as possible.

Looking at my library, I notice I’ve made 86 video’s. Never on the course of the last 20 years have I encountered such a problem with the actual rendering process. I have a Family Project of 1h..40 min. using VP 20. There is a bloc of just pictures at 90% near the end of the video and the rendering process freezes on different pictures.

I take the picture out and redo the rendering, again I notice that it freezes again at the 90% mark on another picture. Instead of taking that picture out, I decide to render that specific part of the Project starting lets say at 80% just to see where it will freeze again…IT DOES NOT freeze at the rendering is perfect.

So my question is why when I render the whole Project does it freeze on a specific pictures or pictures and does not when rendering the bloc that contains those pictures?

Thank you ...Michel

Hi,

I'm including a MediaInfo text file on the picture responsible for the freezing of my recent render process (see previous post). Holping this will help in providing a solution to that Project. 
 GeneralComplete name                            : \Video\Simon\Année 2024\Janvier 2024 - Un hiver de ski\Habileté Saint-Sau_janvier 2024.jpgFormat                                   : JPEGFile size                                : 4.17 MiBImageFormat                                   : JPEGWidth                                    : 4 096 pixelsHeight                                   : 4 096 pixelsColor space                              : YUVChroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0Bit depth                                : 8 bitsCompression mode                         : LossyStream size                              : 4.17 MiB (100%)ColorSpace_ICC                           : RGB

Thanks for the input.

Michel

Hi,

I finally finished my Project. I joined the two mp4 files. The first one that was stopped at around 80% of the project and the second one from 81% to the end. The result is ok. The family should like it. Still don't understand what happened to prevent the rendering of the whole project one shot as explained is my previous post?

All the proposed improvements to my CPU and BIO that you suggested recently, were made yesterday by my brother, Derek and I'm crossing my finger that I'll loose the status of the ''most unlucky'' person dealing the Vegas apps. I'm starting a new Project in a few moments using VP 21. If there is a crash at the beginning, no fuss, I'll shut down 21 and immediatly go to 20. 

That's it for now...have a Great one.

Michel